6/27/2009

I tell ya, I have a way of making friends. :-)

Those of you popping in for the first time or who haven't been here and read through my copious verbosity (a bit redundant, probably) will have missed the utterly delightful (okay, to me, probably not to Roy) exchanges with Roy Mankovitz, who has lead an utterly fascinating life (sincerely, he's an interesting man who has done a lot of things over the years, and I bet would have some frakking awesome stories to tell). So, newbies might not get why I was truly delighted with this response to a comment I made (I won't make you wade through everything if you aren't interested. If you are, click the link and read his original post and my response).

Anyways, I know it seems weird to some but I truly do feel affectionately about my nemeses. Where would I be without them, what would I write? Seriously. Thank you to all of those who write posts that blow my mind, for whatever reason it does so. Roy is a bright man who started off as a scientist, according to his bio and what I could dig up on him; he's done some interesting stuff, is a lawyer according to his linkedin profile from a real college, by the way, has a website, some self-published books because he disdains the establishment. He's interested in health (ah, heck, see the archive for my previous remarks concerning Roy).

So, Roy posts on Huff and almost every single post is him trying to get exposure for his site, his books, and his ideas. Ideas which are at the very least woo-ey. And which I contend aren't scientifically sound. Now, Roy complains that I haven't read his book(s) in the entirety, so I am being biased ( like that's a bad thing). Roy, if you're serious, you can mail me your books to my college: Abilene Educational Center · 717 E. Industrial Blvd · Abilene, TX 79602. I'll read them and give you my honest assessment of them. I'll even look over the references you provide.

His post (frakking beautiful):

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kenneth-thorpe/more-attacks-on-preventio_b_221625.html?page=2&show_comment_id=26272431#comment_26272431

"Hi Kim Wombles:

I see you have adopted another user name, but for me you remain the same caring and well-meaning person you have always been.

Having said that, we do have our differences.

Thank you for your opinion on who qualifies as a research scientist, for your continued biased dissection of my bio, for criticizing research of which you have yet to read, for your insistence that I use the IRB and peer-review research paradigms of the medical community that brought you and the rest of the world dozens of falsified studies, qualified them as the third leading cause of death in the US, and which continues (as you pointed out) to allow them to hide behind journal subscriptions to minimize scrutiny.

By applying your own carefully thought out research strategy, I will certainly consider your advice and your bio, as you have considered mine, and give you and your advice the attention they deserve.

Having said all that, you really are a smart cookie, and I respect your persistence, although I believe it is misdirected."

My response:

Ah, Roy,You're a clever man, and I mean that sincerely. I appreciate the chuckle your post gave me (and I don't mean that in a negative way, more in the challenge, chess-strategy kind of way, you know?).

Now, see, it would hurt my feelings terribly if you went and put me on your short list of nonresponders, so don't go doing that. :-)

It's good to have one's ideas challenged, and IRB boards that consider the ethical ramifications of research are an absolutely necessary, and I do believe legal requirement. Peer review is also vital in order to evaluate claims. After all, if your study can't be replicated, then it can't be shown to be accurate. If you are really about science, you know that and you accept that while peer review ain't perfect, it's the best shot we have at getting to the truth. If you're an honest, ethical man who really wants to help people, then you accept that reality and you work within it.

I'll accept that your intentions are good, your motivations are pure, and your interest in advancing knowledge sincere. Please explain to me why you do not feel, based on my above argument, anyone should listen to what you have learned. Tell me, sir, is there an area where you feel you might perhaps be prone to error? Where you might be willing to admit to being wrong? Or are you absolutely certain of your convictions, never suffering a doubt?

You totally dissed me and told me to kiss off in such a fancy way I couldn't decide whether to be flattered or offended. I decided on entertained. It was a beautiful post, Roy. Wouldn't you miss me if I weren't persistent and didn't comment on your posts? Just a little? I have three other screen names, so you know, but the bios all show they're me; I'm not hiding. If you really want me to read your work so I'm not being so "biased" I guess you'll need to send it to my library. If you're serious. :-) in your search to better your health?


---Update---
I emailed Roy to ask if he would send me his book and he has very kindly said he will. So, see, my nemeses, you can have completely different ideas and still get along. :-)

Thank you kindly, Roy, for agreeing to send me your book. I will read it with an open mind, look into the references you provide, and offer my thoughts on it.

And folks, if you haven't figure it out, I'm easy to make happy. Talk to me some, occasionally give me something (okay, often) to debate about, and I'm ecstatic. Give me a book and it's gold. I love books on everything and getting a new (second hand even, cuz you get 'em cheap so you can buy more) one thrills me no end!

3 comments:

Sirenity said...

I am glad you shared this! Roy does have a certain charm. I have read his book, my mom is a follower of all sorts of interesting (although sometimes scary) 'alternative' ideas.
I found it interesting, although a bit more woo than science.

KWombles said...

Well, you're gonna have to tell him that you've read him; I have no doubt it would make his day.

I've read lots of alternative medicine and Chinese medicine texts. There's an appeal to woo and its magic and there's something to be said for the placebo effect, but I'm a stickler for scientific study. I want to know it works and how if at all possible. Folks who just want the woo, especially folks who have the background to know better, they fascinate me. :-)

kathleen said...

Now I have to read his books...Have you checked out your counter...you are most certainly being read! Yay!!